General DiscussionWOW. 1-8-9 first game as Spectre in 6.85

dispersion wasn't nerfed at all, think you read it wrong

unless you're fighting people with higher armour/magic resist than you (based on the damage you are receiving) it's stronger than before

You got owned before you had bought any real item so I don't think Dispersion "change" has to do anything with it.

WOW. nobody cares

you have 500 spectre matches and you think that dispersion got nerfed?, plz read the change again, now you can build armor/magic resistence instead of raw hp to play around dispersion, now a right click carry cant counter your dispersion with bkb.
AND spectre got a decent buff in desolate, radiance is cheaper, manta is better, diffusal is better, and even phase are better
you only had bad luck man ;)

Don't think you want to build heart on her any more. Skadi better seeing as damage is reflected before reductions now.

Early orb of venom and power treads over nerfed phase boots for sure now. End of discussion about boots :-)

@wonder I'm on the road - does new dispersion reflect physical damage even if the target is magic immune? The wiki tooltip says it doesn't pierce magic immunity so am a bit confused and am not going to download the update via my iPhone abroad :-)

http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/1818094718

idk what u talking about, spectre seems a monster right now, at least in 3k where everyone has a jungler rofl, so i have such ez lane

If I picked Spectre they would put the new Lich and Undying against me, fuckin' nolifers.

might have spoken too soon...

in 6.85, my Spectre now has a chance to fight against a well farmed Anti-Mage in situational cases

If you really want to contest AM directly... if he is blinking to you, all you have to do is build AM items (ie basher/ heart/ lifesteal/ bfly) Spectre out tanks AM by a huge margin and does the same dmg. So Spectre will certainly win that 1 v 1 if you just get 1 v 1 items like AM does.

AM will have to run away, like he does from all real carries. AM is really only good at running away. That's why he plays so much split push and farm.

Heart is much better than Skadi against AM. Skadi could be helpful for Spectre in other situations.

@ Rocket: No Dispersion never has pierced spell immunity and still doesn't, regardless of the type of damage reflected.

The Dispersion change is difficult to classify as either a buff or nerf. In some cases its more effective ( such as when you have high amounts of armour and magic resistance) and it also makes damage block from PMS, Stout shield, vanguard, etc far more effective. However in other situations its worse then it used to be (if enemy has high armour or magic resistance) and its far worse vs Huskar (but you still tear him apart with Desolate)

Ultimately, compared to the old version, dispersion now scales better with Spectre's armour and magic resistance, meaning shes more effective than before if shes ahead and armour auras from teammates are now better then her. However its less effective when Spectre is behind and the enemy team has higher armour and magic resistance then her.

I think the best benefit from the new dispersion is that Vanguard is now far better on Spectre. The old Dispersion blocked damage after reductions. For example, lets say you had lvl 1 Dispersion (10% reduction), a vanguard (40 dmg block) and 0 armour (to make the maths easier for me). if you were hit by a 100 dmg attack then Vanguard would block 40 and then dispersion would reduce by 10% resulting in you taking 56 damage.

With the new dispersion in the same situation First Dispersion would reduce it by 10% to 90 damage then the vanguard would remove another 40 leaving only 50 damage. The 6 damage difference might seem small but it adds up. you can survive 2 or 3 more right clicks with a vanguard now then before.

Long story short: Its a tiny buff to Dispersion and the Vanguard build.

Ok so wonder was a bit off the mark in talking about bkb carries then? Or is he meaning something else.

I see the new dispersion as making her even more cancerous to the enemy supports but less so to the farmed carries.

See myself going power treads, vanguard,radiance,skadi, diffusal now as a basic build.

I think the mistake most people make is assuming that Pure and Physical Damage always go through spell immunity. The way BKB (and all equivalent abilities like repel and rage) works is that it provides 2 things: Spell immunity and 100% magic resistance. To damage someone with BKB you first have to pierce the Spell immunity part then the magic resistance. Any ability that doesn't state "Pierces Spell Immunity" will not go through that first obstacle. Dispersion and most abilities fall into this category. Reapers Scythe, Diabolical Edict and Sonic Wave pierce spell immunity and so get past this first barrier.

Next, any ability that went through the spell immunity will need to get past the 100% magic resistance. Reapers Scythe does magic damage, so despite getting through the spell immunity it will deal 0 damage. However because it went through the spell immunity first all its other effects still apply, such as the stun and added respawn timer. Edict is Physical damage and so it passes the Magic resistance but is still reduced by armour. Sonic wave is pure damage and so also bypasses the 100% magic resistance and does full damage.

Hope that makes things clearer to anyone who was confused!

Actually never thought about reaper scythe respAwn timer going through bkb. That's pretty sneaky. I've missed plenty of kill steals because of that ;-)