General DiscussionRanking of Top 5 or 10 Str Carries in 6.85?

Intentional feeder, scum

Sure. Carry on.

Off top of my head, ck lc mby new slard husk lycan is good. Bristle not typical carry, doom can work, dk?
Nothing else comes to mind, dk mid, perhaps lc, husk lc lycan slard safe.

Edit: forgot sven alchi wk.naix is shit

So mid lc dk tiny (sometimes bristle husk)
Off lc bristle doom
Safe rest. Top this patch prolly doom lc (alchi also got buffed) others optional.

Lycan is the only str carry i like but your build seems bad to me, dont be offended but that hero isnt a teamfighter is a splitpusher with high solo kill potential.
I dont know how much mmr you have but in normal skill you can go full rat in every match and nobody will even notice you destroying the enemy towers. Trust me when you go rat you never look back ;)
Seriously buy necro and destroy all buildings if anybody tp alone to defend you just kill him, dont be afraid about microing his summons.

xan;
I played some WK in my earlier days. The hero can dominate against beginners mostly, since it has 2 life. But at one point, PL-AM-KotL-Nyx start to getting picked against WK and I'm not a 6k player. Tho, I wonder why said shit about Naix? With 16 cd Avatar in pub-games, it's not that bad?
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Wonder; I do insane rats. You can watch my Tiny game if you want to see. Sure, Tiny is better at combats, but in the game there were fights were going on and I was destroying enemy rax instead of fighting. I can say I'm good with Lycan in my last 29 games with the hero. 21W-8L record, and I averaged 6-7k tower damage per win.
I believe hte only unorthodox item for Lycan on my build is Silver Edge. But I find it very useful. When ulti+BKB combo runs out, Lycan is just a sitting duck. You can enter a combat with Silver Edge, then pop out BKB while ulti is almost done. Or helps you escape when BKB runs out. I especially build it against passive reliant heroes such as PA, Void, Slark or against heroes with global skills like Zeus or Invoker. Also it gives you the chance to find a solo kill without using the ulti.

Normal skill players can flame if I don't show up in teamfights. Sometimes, even though I got the win for 'em, I got reported by my teammates to lack of presence in tf's. That's why I seek a good way to do battle better.
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I'm considering learning Huskar and Tiny mainly. I love DK but like I said, I find it very hard to play. No damage until getting crit. CK is also in my mind. (Have been watching some 5.5-6k games and Doom seems pretty relevant on this patch, too.)

Lycan from my view is someone who has the ability to chase down people, especially when they are trying to flee. It doesn't quite work in teamfights unless you can isolate one of your enemies, and you are not kited or focused first. Since you have no disables on your own you will have to rely on your supports most of the time to give you the time to right click. If they are 5-manning you are pretty much screwed especially if they can actually disable you should you recklessly charge in.

However this gives opportunity for you to focus on building since they are together to prevent being hunted by you (although most of the time TP works if they run into you). If they push and are willing to fight under your tower, you are naturally good at pushing as Lycan so use this opportunity to take towers, or force a bad fight from your enemies. But, if you want to go fighter Lycan at a 5-man team, chances are you don't get to run down anyone and your teammates can't help you because you run at 600+ ms but they don't.

Of course that's just my opinion. When their team is 5-manning you go rat.

If you don't mute everyone in Normal Skill you're just playing the game wrong. I've practically AFK farmed with Naix in jungle while my team was feeding hard in the dumbest way possible. I got flamed and reported, decided to mute all of them, ended up winning the game for them. because nobody fucked my farm, though they did try to gank me a few times.

Mushi;
I'll try to explain myself about joining teamfights from map positions.
I don't look for a fight generally. Let's assume there is a teamfight near a T1 tower. I use my ulti in the middle of my T2-T3 towers or in/near Roshan pit. And if I have my Shadow Blade, generally they don't see me coming. And I focus on their main disabler such as Lion, Bane, Shaman or Shaker.
So, to be clear about combats; I don't initiate. But if there is a fight going on and if my chance is good, I join the fight. The only way I initiate, if we have sight and there is a 4-5 man coming our way, I use Lothar and isolate/kill their main disabler even before combat begins.

Sure, sometimes I get caught by 5 man but I use the ulti to run (and pop out BKB if I have it and if it's necessary).

I have a 73% win rate on Lycan on my other account.

No offense but thinking " i play lycan as a carry " is very very very very very very very very wrong.

Most other carries out do him when it comes to fighting, and benefiting from carry items.

If you give a phantom assassin, an antimage, an ursa, or phantom lancer, or legion commander, or basically any other carry 15k gold and u give it to lycan, and u make them go 1v1, Lycan will lose every fight pretty much.

You need to build Necro 3, Boots of travel, and then preferablly either BKB or Deso or AC.

If an enemy carry is giving ur team a lot of trouble, skull basher, heavens halberd are choices.

You don't understand how to play Lycan.

You are a space creator. When the enemy team thinks "ok guys at this point we can kill the other team and win."

their whole team has to be scared that when they group up, ur gonna teleport, push creeps to a tower, use ur ULT, use necro 3,

and take down their tower and barracks so fast that they can barely react. Lycan should be able to end a game by 35 mins easily.

being a carry means you need to waste time farming, 45+ mins games.. Lycan at that point becomes useless other than being able to push..

also, there is no such thing as "top carries" one "top carry" will get absolutely raped by a counter..

focus less on which carries are better focus more on which carry you need to COUNTER the enemy team and WIN.

^ "carry" doesn't simply mean hero who kills the enemy heroes. If a Lycan won the game by pushing and pressuring the other team to the point where they couldn't react to the rest of Lycan's team, he basically carried that game, regardless of which hero in his team got the most kills.

The less long-range disables/initiators the enemies have the more you want to split-push because it's OP when the enemies can't do shit about it. But you can surely go for build that makes you both a good fighter and a good pusher, like vlads, deso, AC, basher.

in order of preference:
1) Tiny - i play him in the safe lane, a bit situational pick
2) Lone Druid - very tricky to win with this hero. micro is just one side of it. the game play is another.
3) Life Stealer - also tricky to win with this hero. can easily be out-carried if you don't gain mid-game advantage
4) Chaos Knight - easy to play mechanically but game play could widely vary
5) Huskar - i also find him tricky to play. haven't mastered yet how to play him especially during clashes.
6) Lycan - good against ursa

Um... how is lycan good against Ursa? Sure he can run away from him and "kite" him at above max speed, but if he chooses to attack Ursa, he will just die if he tries to trade hits. You just don't kill Ursa melee unless he's trash/has no farm and levels and you have a way to disable him really hard. Ranged heroes that build slows/have disables are generally good against Ursa, I don't see how Lycan would be, I think Ursa'll be able to burst him down long before Lycan (with all his summons) can chip away even half of his HP.

EDIT: He can also deny Ursa's aegis with invis wolf, that's a good one tho.

FreeThought;
You haven't read my other posts than the opening one in the thread. Right?
I stated that I do rat, my tower damage average is fairly good, I stated I started to join combats after getting flamed. The only thing you can be critical about is me building Silver Edge over Necronomicon. I guess BKB, Basher/Abyssal, AC, Heart on Lycan is something never heard of?.. Pointless post. Especially the last line... So self righteous. Sorry to break up to you.
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I tried playing Doom. I felt good but enemy team was so bad... I can not judge my performance properly.
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Yeah. I won 1v1s against Slark, PA or Void with Lycan. But I don't see Lycan defeating Ursa. Unless Ursa is way underfarmed, Ursa would bury Lycan to the ground.

^it is just too situational. Necronomican is going to be a better item in 99% games because it actually lets you do what you do, only better. Silver Edge lets you do some other things that are not really enhanced by your hero's abilities and his general purpose, which is to eat towers. Also, silver edge is 5k+ gold item, in most games it is just way better to get an AC or desolator or necro 3, etc, instead of it. It just boils down to - when are you going to build silver edge? At any point you choose to do it, you're ruining your pushing potential. I'd probably get a silver edge if I am the only one who can farm it up, and there's an annoying passive their carry has. For example, abyssal and silver edge would certainly do good against spectre, even if you do not want to fight her, if she starts owning your team and you are the only one who gets any farm whatsoever, you should obviously get it.

Shadow Shaman can build skadi but then again, he can also get a refresher, which will actually help him do what he does best, instead of being a mediocre item for him.

ck wk rk alch lc

it's like:
1. TONY
2. all the agi heroes in random order
3. axe
4. a few int heroes
5. strength heroes

tony stronk

" The only thing you can be critical about is me building Silver Edge over Necronomicon. I guess BKB, Basher/Abyssal, AC, Heart on Lycan is something never heard of?"

OH UR TOWER DAMAGE WITH LYCAN IS GOOD? WOW.. WOULDN'T EXPECT THAT WITH THE #1 HERO IN DOTA WHEN IT COMES TO TOWER DAMAGE.. YOU'RE ALWAYS GOING TO GET HIGH TOWER DAMAGE WHEN YOU PLAY WITH LYCAN... HERPP DERPP..

YOU BUILD SILVERS EDGE OVER NECRO?? OK....

YOU OBV DONT UNDERSTAND WHAT IM SAYING..

IF YOU ARE INFRONT OF A TOWER.. YOU HAVE 2 WOLVES.. UR SKILL THAT ADDS DAMAGE TO ALL UR ALLIED UNITS.. UR ULT WHICH GIVES A BONUS TO UR CONTROLLED UNITS.. AND NECRO 3.. MAYBE MINUS ARMOR, YOU CAN EASILY TAKE A TOWER, THEN THE NEXT TOWER, THEN THE BARRACKS.. IN ABOUT 1 MINUTE.. YOU CAN END THE GAME SIMPLY FOR THE HEROS ON UR ENEMY TEAM NOT CARRYING TP SCROLLS..

SILVERS EDGE / HEART DOES NOT COMPARE TO THIS FORM OF PUNISHMENT..

LOL YOU ARR TRYNA INSULT ME BY SAYING " SORRY TO BREAK IT TO U BUT CARRY LYCAN IS A THING.." KK BRO.. DO ME A FAVOR, DO A CUSTOM MATCH, USE CHEATS, GIVE LYCAN NECRO 3 AND AC , SEE HOW FAST THAT TOWER MELTS..

DO ANOTHER CUSTOM MATCH, GIVE LYCAN HEART AND SILVERS EDGE .. THERE IS NO COMPARISON.

OBVIOUSLY THERE IS NO CONVICING YOU. I TRIED TO GIVE U A BETTER WAY TO PLAY LYCAN, BUT HEY, DON'T LISTEN TO ME, I JUST HAVE A WAY HIGHER WIN RATE THAN U DO . LOL .

ANYWAYS GOOD LUCK BUDDY.

1 MORE THING : ALL OF LYCANS SKILLS BENEFIT UNITS UNDER HIS CONTROL AND ALLIED UNITS, THE WHOLE POINT OF HIS SKILLS IS TO HAVE MORE MINIONS / UNITS UNDER HIS CONTROL.. HERP DERP.

Most of the strength carries shine a bit earlier than agility ones but fall off later and don't farm as well. Think of all the carries with stuns, they're all strength. Sven wk ck tiny dk. But the agi heroes have better Abilities for farming like crit on jug and pa and bash on void and split shot on dusa.

Personally I think Sven, ck and tiny are the strongest str carries and only ones that can really keep up with agi ones but they hav weakness. Lycan is awesome for pushing. Wk is quite good but too easily countered with mana burns. Lifestealer gets kited too hard and doesn't do enough imo. Slardar can be sweet but that dmg amp on his sprint hurts him a lot

i love tiny. with agh lvl 16 he can just chip away the fucking towers.

I find it weird legion has become way more popular with kind of small buffs.

Well she's always been good, even in 6.84, she was perfect for locking down AM, Ember, and Storm. Now that her competition has been nerfed, and her herself buffed, she's automatically higher on the tier list of best heroes in 6.85.

One thing that's funny was Ember, he didn't get popularity until Ti5, before it, NO ONE was using, I remember saying he sucked too (report me) many people were saying he was trash, and that he needed like 2 daedalus to even be useful. lol
He's probably a solid core this patch due to not getting any nerfs.

Well, ember only got popular because people spammed PL all the time, and if he catches all PL illusions in fist AoE and has like 2 battlefuries and a daedalus, PL's almost certainly dead unless he times his escape properly. And I've played a lot of legion against people who pick heroes like these, if they are cocky and don't have much in terms of backup, I will certainly kill them, no matter how much they lead, blink blademail is all I need for ember to kill himself, since I will certainly have more hp than he does, and he has two people beating on him.

I wonder how lifestealer is gonna do in following comp matches, that should be interesting. He still has a ton of problems to overcome I feel.

Lone druid is agi, not str.

Also in any skill level wk is better than naix.