General DiscussionSpectre - diffusal vs rad

brown boots and radiance specter should be autoreported. I see no problem with specter not going rad at all. But there are otehr choices except rad vs diffusal. Check the top specter games. E.g. https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/3319706205?guide=02cfb4

Because radi under 20 min mark is usually already a won game. Thats why its not ez to farm this item on this hero. Sven avtually counter spectre, you can only fight him with blademail and heart, not manta.

i wonder how many of these spectre threads just popped up cause you guys got the immortals :D gotta admit tho it's the only that is shitty in that box

why would you begin your build with wand instead of the pms when you can complete the pms at teh side shop as soon as you pick up the bounty rune?

Radiance all the way, because it allows you to farm with manta illus. You might skip it, if game goes really dogshit.

And always this: XY counters spectre. Spectre is not the best hero to go toe to toe with many carries. Thats simply not the point of her. Just kill enemy carries team faster than he kills your team. Never go brown boots radi, thats retarded.

Wrote this a week ago:

I strongly disagree with many answers. Just get used to her, play her often. Spectre is rly ez to win with. My current MMR is 4.4k (int ranked). And I normally hover between low mid 4k.
Unless the enemy runs a real strong duallofflane, you should be fine. Every meleecarry gets trashed by a dualofflane. I was allowed to play against a viper tree offlane yesterday. No carry at all could handle that lane and farm up, unless you have two rly stronk supports on your lane.
1. Step one:
Dont miss lasthits. Spectre has a shitty basedamage, a long bat, long backswing, shitty turnrate and movespeed. So getting 50-70cs with spectre in the laning stage is something you need to learn.
2. Step two:
Go some utility items, so you can get kills midgame with haunt. Brown boots radiance rush is bullshit. It makes you get that radiance later in 9 out of 10 games. You cant kill, you cant use phase dagger to escape a gank, you farm jungle slower (cuz less damage).
OOV is fine, so you can chase better, phase is a must have.
I do not like vanguard, cause it costs a lot and does not give much potential for killing.
Urn is some fine item.
If you need constant regen, a casual roh is enough. You can built it into a refresher orb later on or simply sell it.
In some cases Talon is fine, so you can clear jungle faster. Ring of aquila is also sometimes ok. PMS is good to go. Drums are also a nice item on spectre. The new Hod is kinda shit. Do not go for it. Not enough bang for the buck.
Next item after one or two of the above mentioned items should be radiance or yasha. Depends on your timings and if you are forced to fight more early. In some cases you might need to skip the radicance entirly.
Some ppl like to mask of madness. I do not like the item on spectre at all.
Midas is some kind of last resort, if everything goes bad in the first 12 min on all lanes, and you know that you will not get any farmspace.
A spectre with urn, phase, oov, pms kinda hits hard in the midgame, if you haunt in proper into lone fleeing targets. Desolate is your source of damage, so you should be able to net kills in the midgame. Its just a matter of timing and expierience. Haunt in, use dagger to snatch a kill (or 1-2 hits). If your team ganks and corners a good farmed enemy core, haunt and try to snatch the kill. Tp back to your lane.
Do not haunt for every gank on a support. Your ulti is precious. Its just a matter of expierence when to jump. Sometimes haunting is also a good idea to distract the enemy and prevent them from diving your midlaner.
You max out dagger and desolate. One point in dispersion is enough. Its percentagebased and the lvls 2-4 only give relativly low ehp compared to the first lvl. Your skilltree should be damage, stats, attackspeed, strength, hp in 99% if all games. Sometimes the extra armor is nice. If you go for Mom (which is kinda cheesy built) you should go for the armor. The movespeed is also sometimes fine. Somehow it has a higher winrate 0,8%. Neverless i like the stats more.
Get that radiance running. You sould be able to get it >25 min mark, with phase, urn pms and in a good game even with a yasha. Next item should be manta. It speeds up your farm big time. Use mantasplit to farm multiple camps and the lane. Just ctrl+1 on spectre, 2 on first illu, 3 on the second illu. By this time you should be a major threat to your enemy. But you still need to be cautious and farm passivly with your illus and with the hero itself in safe space.
Next item depends on whats needed and your playstyle. Heart is a good idea in many cases, in some cases its pure shit. Butterfly is almost everytime a good idea. Diffu is almost every time a must have. Skadi is also not so bad on spectre.
Refresher orb can rly wreck the shit out of the enemy, but its more of 7. slot item for your backpack. Before 7.00 it was my standard 4th item after diffu. 14 sek haunt would wreck every enemy, no pipe, no euls or cape could save the supports for this long time. Enemys have to spent their precious spells on teammates, sicne they cant wait 14 sek till you appear on the battlefield.
Spectre has somewhat the best carrypotential in the game and one of the best comeback ultis, since you can always be in the right spot to snatch the kill on the snowballing enemy. With a radiance in your inventory you are always a threat. Pubbers till mid 4k tend the throw, so in most games you will get your comback-chance.

There's nothing wrong with going diffusal, manta, then radiance. Radiance isn't just a farming item for spec despite what everyone says, it's one of his end game items, so if build up is too hard you can get it later. Diffusal is a pretty big power spike for her too.

well diffusal is too godo to skip anyway, but the question is to go radiance manta (heart) diffusal of difffusal manta radiance something something

If you rush vanguard first and then randiance in 30 until 40 mins using my waifu, I will report you

Radiance is a massive power spike on spec
I skip diffusal if I don't need it, but sometimes u want something like ur yasha diffusal if ur getting rekt instead of rad.

The people that go diffusal first iin my game I never see that spectre win even if they go radiance later. The spectre that go radiance first even if they had a hard lane tend to recover alot better and end up winning. Just my 2 cents

Dont try to pick spectre unless u have good teammate or no afk jungler till 20 minutes mark

Im the guy who build diffusal and manta first before rush radiance. And guest what, I still undefeated with that build

^and guess what?You have 47% winrate in 2K HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

Sorry bad joke ma bad

^what if i pick spec in all my game?

your last spec game was an abandon...is this ur way of staying undefeated

^^You will get 50% winrate in 2.5K?

Do it... first pick spec in all your games and get lice tea approval

Both are good in their own ways.
Use your brain.

Vladimir knows what he's talking about. I would ignore what everyone else said in this thread if I were you.

But but but, my spec can only brown boots rushing radiance. And thats is the only way I (2k scrub) can got radi before 25 mins.

Yeah ok, i also making urns between brown and radi. This item really helpfull midgame in those 15-20 minutes. People say phase but I go urn instead. Like phase, I still can clean up fleeing enemies. Unlike phase I can heal myself when needed, and the mana regen always give me ready stock of ult any time its off cooldown. Also brown+urn have same-ish cost as phase. I also can easily go BoT from brown in case I have to turtling and counter rats.

Though I really need buy quelling. To help last hit (because I suck, 2k, remember?). It makes it quells+brown+urn which is more expensive than just a phase. I cover the movespeed with the 25ms talent and leaving behind the 8 stats.

PMS only when I got harassed by ranged atk, wand when I got harassed by spells.

And I always go to radi no matter what. Before even thinking BM/manta.

By the time I got tarasque, i know I will have big chance (almost every time of it) to carry my team. Unless i have derping momments to die without buyback.

Also, some people really prefer skadi to tarasque. Though, standing still with full health at enemy fountain thx to tarasque regen is the best way to demoralize enemy morale.

I might need to try quelles&urnless phase boots next time.

why picking movement speed talent over stat ? idont understand the logic

25 ms is half of the boots. In the world where you cant buy another boots for the ms bonus. it is significant.

Its big. Bigger than 80% of ultimate orb IMO. I mean, its like ms vs stats in phase vs PT, and many people prefer phase for spec.

Its another ms besides boots and manta move speed bonus. Well, might be not as fast as hyperspace speed of razor, but compared with another tanky hero, ms talent spectre is a race car.

Just look at my spectre games and learn man :)

@(TIBDP) i abb because game crash. hell we winning that game