it really depends on the situation things like this can change how you deal dmg
-where you are (are towers near, his allies etc.)
-how much mana you have
-does he have detection
but yes if you follow your method you will do the most dmg in the shortest amount of time
hey do you mind watching my bh game (i only have one on this account but its pretty much what i do in most cases so hopefully you can still provide some good advice)
Can't wait for your next guide. May it be Lich, please? I'm very bad with this hero and don't know what items to build. Is Armlet of Mordiggian viable?
I just take a look on your matches record using BH and realized the latest match you played where your items are 4 Ring of Health, Deso, and Linken. That is one cool build. So, how's that build went? (im a fan of this unexpected item build)
**im new to Dota 2, never play Dota 1, my first post in the forum, my English is below average. Please no hating.**
^I like this build (with exception of Assault Cuirass, this item is out of the line, Orchid or even hex should be better). Bounty Hunter is very similar to Nyx Assassin, and no doubt can be played same way.
it has nothing with being dumb it has to do with me messing around.
Soultrap, you are under the impressing that I mind you trolling my thread but I really do not you are helping advertise my guide and make it easier for me to win the contest :P
-the boots where a bad option to start with (stout shield would have been a much better pick up due to their lack of lockdown)
-you need to watch your range a little better because there where a few points where you sat outside of exp range due to miss calculation of the range
-putting a 2nd lv into wind walk would have helped you alot more at lv 5
-you spend alot of time with low health/mana not accomplishing anything and you could have walked back to base healed up and TP'd to new location to gank (make sure you always have a TP scroll)
-another note with TP scrolls when you died you should have bought 2 (one to get you to the mid and another rdy for later)
- at the 10min mark you just wasted a ton of mana/health to smack the lycan once
-build phase boots before drums
-at the 15min mark you should have dove the clinkz instead of fleeing
-for the 2-1-2-1 build to work you need to have a poison orb
-at the 16min mark when you where trying to kill jug save your track for when he spins that way he cant remove it and run away
-17min team fight you are too quick to flee giving your opponent a chance to turn around a fight in their favor
-you spend alot of time slapping lycan for no reason (dont bother touching him unless you have someone to hold him in place)
-you seem to be roaming alot not accomplishing anything you need to be realistic about who you can and cannot kill. Jug invoker and clinkz should be who you chase around NOT lycan
-at the 26min mark you should have gave that invis rune to a teammate and gotten a easy kill instead of bottling it
-I would have gotten a S/Y or orchid to deal with these high mobility heroes
Overall not too bad the biggest mistakes came from the bottle (it had no game impact and pretty much a crutch for when you made mistakes), lack of TP scroll on hand during the majority of the game, poor choices on ganking target and playing a too defensive during team fights (you tend to panic flee then turn around later)
I love this build but haven;t had success with it lately. Almost every game i lost vs. a nother Bh they either got it easy or gone deso/battlefury. 10/10 on guide tho!
I agree that Bottle is overrated on BH. As mentioned one of the strengths of the hero is the fear factor, and getting a bottle becomes a commitment to specific locations at specific times, restricting your movement and giving enemies a good idea of where you will be at certain times. All of this for a 50% chance to snag a rune, near a spot where both Observers and Sentries are common? And all this time could be spent ganking or sapping XP somewhere. Bottle crowing as an offlaner is also pretty selfish and puts an unneccesary burden on your teammates.
I like to grab an early Basilius in lane - if you get it before you spend too much of your mana pool, you can sustain WW in lane. It also gives you a way to break invisibility if you get dusted, so you aren't slowed massively. Builds into a Vlads easily, which gives you the sustain to roam the map alll game and really put the fear into the enemy.
As for skills, I like to go E>W>E>Q>Q>R>W>W>W>Q>R. I think you underestimate Jinada's usefulness.
If you look at your own item build, it's reasonable to assume that by level 10 you'll have:
At level 10 you have an average of 75 base dmg, combined with above you get 120 dmg.
Jinada at level 4=270 dmg
Jinada at 3 (if you go with 2 in WW)=240dmg
That's much higher than what WW is giving you, and what you posted previously.
If you want to be really conservative, let's say you don't have drums, but just a Bracer.
114 base dmg
Jinada4=256.5 dmg
Jinada3=228 dmg
That is just raw damage, you also get the slow on shorter cooldown procing more often (6 seconds in a fight is standard, 12 seconds is an ETERNITYYYY.)
You highly overestimate how much gear a real trilane will give you. Having stout shield poison orb and boots by lv 5-6 is fairly common unless you managed to swing mid and grab a kill at the 4-5 mark in mid. If you look at the guide I did mention that there is flexibility to start pushing points into Jinada sooner(at the lv 8 mark) if you are doing reasonably well. If you look at everything in a vacuum only lv'n shuriken up to level 2 seems like a good idea because that is the best dmg increase and best use of mana BUT that 50-100 dmg is what can score you those early track kills and allow you to snowball into the mid game.
I would be lying if I said that I dont commonly have quite alot of items by lv 6 in pubs but that is usually because of awful trilanes not having a clue how to kill the pressure up.
I got linkens so I could backdoor without getting caught out
the match should have been over at the 30min mark but for 30mins my teammates ran into veno kotl ET combo over and over and over and over and over and over again.
I think I was 9-1-4 or somethingby 25mins. My teams weaver refused to split push and thought it was a good idea to 'team fight'
I am not sure if it is that I just cant play Mirana or cant play mid. BUT doesnt matter I will keep destroying my MM til I get her down because I know how strong she is lol
@Daggius
it really depends on the situation things like this can change how you deal dmg
-where you are (are towers near, his allies etc.)
-how much mana you have
-does he have detection
but yes if you follow your method you will do the most dmg in the shortest amount of time
You can laugh at my account 'buying' ass and Ill laugh at your bad pretentious Gondar playing ass. Replay watching here I come.
Listen what #1 Bounty Hunter says.
Sampson is legit. Someone who takes time to put out a well-written piece on the forums instead of the typical MMR circlejerking should be appreciated.
^100% this
@crimsonSoldier to be fair, he occasionally does both) But I agree that the guide is well-written and I really like it.
hey do you mind watching my bh game (i only have one on this account but its pretty much what i do in most cases so hopefully you can still provide some good advice)
and nice guide
I will watch tomorrow, practice killed all the energy I had left for the night
Can't wait for your next guide. May it be Lich, please? I'm very bad with this hero and don't know what items to build. Is Armlet of Mordiggian viable?
^ you are a very poor troll
k thanks
Sampson. We have only two living beings in Russia: bears and trolls.
I'm not a bear.
http://dotabuff.com/topics/2014-02-16-supports-in-late-game
stay in that thread I would rather not have your incompetence spreading
I finally made you to reply on my posts. Success for a troll. =)
You are the one who was sure that auras not working if you invisible. And you call me "incompetent". Rude.
There is a line between trolling and being dumb, you tried to cover your tracks of being completely clueless with 'naw bro im just trolling'.
I do not mind the free bumps
Wait, what exactly dumb did I said?
@Sampson
I just take a look on your matches record using BH and realized the latest match you played where your items are 4 Ring of Health, Deso, and Linken. That is one cool build. So, how's that build went? (im a fan of this unexpected item build)
**im new to Dota 2, never play Dota 1, my first post in the forum, my English is below average. Please no hating.**
Who Samspson teaches ^. I wish you luck on your fanbase haha.
^ thank you.
I watched Admiral Bulldog too much that's why I end up playing like this with my BH :(
http://dotabuff.com/matches/520274298
^I like this build (with exception of Assault Cuirass, this item is out of the line, Orchid or even hex should be better). Bounty Hunter is very similar to Nyx Assassin, and no doubt can be played same way.
Can i make a OD guide boys ? D:
Wrong thread. Also, Anyone can make guides. Knock yourself out~
^Ok ok chill
Anyone can make threads, Even trash
^No, trash can make only more trash.
Do not put too much stock into what I build in random pubs. If any of my items deviate from the guide I am either
A) Trolling
B) There was a very specific reason ( I build necrobook to speed up matches sometimes)
usually A
^There is a line between trolling and being dumb, you tried to cover your tracks of being completely clueless with 'naw bro im just trolling'.
http://dotabuff.com/matches/460858209
it has nothing with being dumb it has to do with me messing around.
Soultrap, you are under the impressing that I mind you trolling my thread but I really do not you are helping advertise my guide and make it easier for me to win the contest :P
played some bh last nite
was skeptical at first, but can confirm the goodness of 2-1-2-1 build over 3-1-1-1
level 3 shuriken only adds 50 damage over level 2, while level 2 shadow walk adds 30 damage + 5 sec duration over level 1
the extra duration is worth 20 less damage.
especially considering that you will likely hit them out of shadow walk twice when going for the kill, while only use shuriken once.
so you're actually getting +60 damage out of the shadow walk level (10 more than shuriken)
@Trash
-the boots where a bad option to start with (stout shield would have been a much better pick up due to their lack of lockdown)
-you need to watch your range a little better because there where a few points where you sat outside of exp range due to miss calculation of the range
-putting a 2nd lv into wind walk would have helped you alot more at lv 5
-you spend alot of time with low health/mana not accomplishing anything and you could have walked back to base healed up and TP'd to new location to gank (make sure you always have a TP scroll)
-another note with TP scrolls when you died you should have bought 2 (one to get you to the mid and another rdy for later)
- at the 10min mark you just wasted a ton of mana/health to smack the lycan once
-build phase boots before drums
-at the 15min mark you should have dove the clinkz instead of fleeing
-for the 2-1-2-1 build to work you need to have a poison orb
-at the 16min mark when you where trying to kill jug save your track for when he spins that way he cant remove it and run away
-17min team fight you are too quick to flee giving your opponent a chance to turn around a fight in their favor
-you spend alot of time slapping lycan for no reason (dont bother touching him unless you have someone to hold him in place)
-you seem to be roaming alot not accomplishing anything you need to be realistic about who you can and cannot kill. Jug invoker and clinkz should be who you chase around NOT lycan
-at the 26min mark you should have gave that invis rune to a teammate and gotten a easy kill instead of bottling it
-I would have gotten a S/Y or orchid to deal with these high mobility heroes
Overall not too bad the biggest mistakes came from the bottle (it had no game impact and pretty much a crutch for when you made mistakes), lack of TP scroll on hand during the majority of the game, poor choices on ganking target and playing a too defensive during team fights (you tend to panic flee then turn around later)
Good luck on future BH matches
I love this build but haven;t had success with it lately. Almost every game i lost vs. a nother Bh they either got it easy or gone deso/battlefury. 10/10 on guide tho!
aight thanks for the help sampson appreciate it
@ Sampson
Great guide. Good review on trash's game well done! Keep it up! :)
wall of text done lol
I will be playing alot of bounty hunter matches to give people an idea of how you want to play.
Keep in mind I am not perfect and make alot of dumb mistakes (giving away first blood in my last match :P)
Just wanted to throw in some comments.
I agree that Bottle is overrated on BH. As mentioned one of the strengths of the hero is the fear factor, and getting a bottle becomes a commitment to specific locations at specific times, restricting your movement and giving enemies a good idea of where you will be at certain times. All of this for a 50% chance to snag a rune, near a spot where both Observers and Sentries are common? And all this time could be spent ganking or sapping XP somewhere. Bottle crowing as an offlaner is also pretty selfish and puts an unneccesary burden on your teammates.
I like to grab an early Basilius in lane - if you get it before you spend too much of your mana pool, you can sustain WW in lane. It also gives you a way to break invisibility if you get dusted, so you aren't slowed massively. Builds into a Vlads easily, which gives you the sustain to roam the map alll game and really put the fear into the enemy.
As for skills, I like to go E>W>E>Q>Q>R>W>W>W>Q>R. I think you underestimate Jinada's usefulness.
If you look at your own item build, it's reasonable to assume that by level 10 you'll have:
Wand: +3 dmg
PMS: +6 dmg
Phase: +24 dmg
Drums: +12 dmg
At level 10 you have an average of 75 base dmg, combined with above you get 120 dmg.
Jinada at level 4=270 dmg
Jinada at 3 (if you go with 2 in WW)=240dmg
That's much higher than what WW is giving you, and what you posted previously.
If you want to be really conservative, let's say you don't have drums, but just a Bracer.
114 base dmg
Jinada4=256.5 dmg
Jinada3=228 dmg
That is just raw damage, you also get the slow on shorter cooldown procing more often (6 seconds in a fight is standard, 12 seconds is an ETERNITYYYY.)
You highly overestimate how much gear a real trilane will give you. Having stout shield poison orb and boots by lv 5-6 is fairly common unless you managed to swing mid and grab a kill at the 4-5 mark in mid. If you look at the guide I did mention that there is flexibility to start pushing points into Jinada sooner(at the lv 8 mark) if you are doing reasonably well. If you look at everything in a vacuum only lv'n shuriken up to level 2 seems like a good idea because that is the best dmg increase and best use of mana BUT that 50-100 dmg is what can score you those early track kills and allow you to snowball into the mid game.
I would be lying if I said that I dont commonly have quite alot of items by lv 6 in pubs but that is usually because of awful trilanes not having a clue how to kill the pressure up.
sampson
in this game in special: http://dotabuff.com/matches/531959284
why did you go linkens?
To stop courier from targeting him. #newmeta.
No seriously I love reading this thread. It's great dicussion.
Because there are only 2 ways to cancel that, Mana Leak and Spirit Lance. Both are very annoying versus BH because he likes moving, also FAST in that.
I got linkens so I could backdoor without getting caught out
the match should have been over at the 30min mark but for 30mins my teammates ran into veno kotl ET combo over and over and over and over and over and over again.
I think I was 9-1-4 or somethingby 25mins. My teams weaver refused to split push and thought it was a good idea to 'team fight'
That match was legit the worst match of my life
I would have gone BKB if my team was competent though and the weaver just hit towers like a normal person
I am trying to forget last night ever happened, I am going to go for counseling for post traumatic stress disorder :(
So sampson, how is going the mirana plays ?
Nice job :)
I am not sure if it is that I just cant play Mirana or cant play mid. BUT doesnt matter I will keep destroying my MM til I get her down because I know how strong she is lol
you can't run from the trench